The conditions essential for creating man or animal. - The way how God creates man and animal (Sep/15/2007 )
eanassir.
eanassir, you must be really a lucky guy. Everything is so simple, so straightforward and clear, there are no doubts, no ambiguity, no grey, only black and white. Only one truth. If someone is asking, has doubts, quibbles over something, has reservations....no problem, just quote some Quran lines and the problem is solved. Everything is so simple...
It's a pity that mankind is not thinking this easy way: only one religion, one faith. An earth full of peace and simplicity with Mecca (or alternatively Rome) as epicentre of power. No need for this variety of religions, traditions, and regional differences, producing to much diversity and plurality. Much too complicated and too difficult to understand. Hence it should be forbidden.
I guess there is the devil - be wicked- behind it.
If your Quran has all the answer, you Arabs would not be in this shape. Think about it.
eanassir.
eanassir, you must be really a lucky guy. Everything is so simple, so straightforward and clear, there are no doubts, no ambiguity, no grey, only black and white. Only one truth. If someone is asking, has doubts, quibbles over something, has reservations....no problem, just quote some Quran lines and the problem is solved. Everything is so simple...
It's a pity that mankind is not thinking this easy way: only one religion, one faith. An earth full of peace and simplicity with Mecca (or alternatively Rome) as epicentre of power. No need for this variety of religions, traditions, and regional differences, producing to much diversity and plurality. Much too complicated and too difficult to understand. Hence it should be forbidden.
I guess there is the devil - be wicked- behind it.
God - be exalted - said in the Quran 31: 30
{ذَلِكَ بِأَنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ الْحَقُّ وَأَنَّ مَا يَدْعُونَ مِن دُونِهِ الْبَاطِلُ وَأَنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ الْعَلِيُّ الْكَبِيرُ}
The explanation: (30. [All] that [indicate that] it is God Who is the True [Creator], and that what they serve – apart from Him – is the untrue, and that it is God Who is the Most High, the Great.)
In fact, God knows who is the wicked and devil, and who is other than that.
eanassir.
Did you know, that you can evoke spiritual feelings in human by stimulating a cetain region of the brain? Additionally this region seems to be more active in people who strongly believe in God (no matter which).
So, there is the question, who created who?
Are we created by a allknowing, allmighty god, or did we created gods by ourselves because we want them to be?
CdI,
Yes, brianwashed will be the right terminology to describe this.
So, there is the question, who created who?
Are we created by a allknowing, allmighty god, or did we created gods by ourselves because we want them to be?
Do you have a reference for the brain stimulation story? Or is it another urban myth?
So, there is the question, who created who?
Are we created by a allknowing, allmighty god, or did we created gods by ourselves because we want them to be?
Do you have a reference for the brain stimulation story? Or is it another urban myth?
Here are my current opinions, I am completely open to discussion and comments, I love this stuff!
This is not a myth, the idea that a "religious experience" can be induced I think is well supported
1) besides the study above many instances can be cited in history, high emotion, chanting, drum beats etc. can contribute to this type of ethereal experience
2) this may explain why there are many different religous groups that subscribe to these practices in their worship, leads to an actual "experience" that can be interpreted as spiritual.
This should not be troubling to those who believe in God because
1) belief in God should not be about "ethereal religious experiences" these feelings are flighty and not a stable ground for any belief to be structured on (Christians think of the "mountaintop experience" and the many discussions of how faith can falter when you "come down from the mountaintop")
2) I personally believe that God wants us to think and analyze things, (not take things literally) and use our mind this is found in the bible and, apparently, in the Quran:
say: All prise and glorifications is due to God Almighty; He is Worty of all praise and gratitude.
God - be glorified - said in the Quran 38: 29
{كِتَابٌ أَنزَلْنَاهُ إِلَيْكَ مُبَارَكٌ لِّيَدَّبَّرُوا آيَاتِهِ وَلِيَتَذَكَّرَ أُوْلُوا الْأَلْبَابِ}
The explanation: ([This Quran is] a Scripture that We have revealed to you [Mohammed], full of blessing, that they may ponder its revelations, and that men of understanding may reflect.)
Now, in response to the original discussion, I would re-iterate the part about using our minds and not taking things literally. The disussions of the origins of life in both the Bible, and from my understanding here of the Quran are not to be taken as "God speaking down the exact manner in which things happened" they are historical stories about what people believed at the time were the conditions under which life was created or the conditions required for life.
Besides these issues really have nothing to do with what it means to me to have a "relationship with God"/"belief in God" etc. To me what the Bible is about is a way to help you figure out how to deal with other people, how to live your life, not literally but more like a series of examples... I am open to the idea that there may be many ways to come about the same answers, found in other religions for example, and I think that the real goal is to try to live a loving, life, caring for others more than yourself, self-sacrificing if you will, not condemning others/judging anyone else, essentially following the examples set by Jesus in the stories found in the Bible.
I am a Christian so I will focus on that. Interestingly when you try to focus on what is really important about being a Christian (the characteristics mentioned above) alot of the crap people fight over is really unimportant, who cares how God created the world or whether he chose to tell us all about it 2000 years ago (again not buying this), in fact it doesn't really even matter if you look at Jesus as "God incarnate" or just a really good human example, what is important is not affected by these mediocrities.
If only some of these beliefs weren't so destructive, and actually produced responses and characteristics completely in contrast to the important things I would say believe what you want, unfortunately things like blind faith and taking the bible literally lead to horrible consequences, hatred of others, a sense of self-righteousness rather than humility, a tendency to be judgemental and closed minded. Horrible reprecussions of religion and indeed a very evil force in the world in my opinon.
To quote Rodney King "Why can't we just all get along" I mean come on, have some respect for other peoples beliefs and cultures, do your best to live a loving life and use your minds! Things are not automatically true because some king in the 16th century decided to put them together in a book.
Again, I like to think about these things and am definately still in a learning process and would love to hear comments and other opinions.
Thanks for "listening" hope you have a wonderful weekend!!!
Besides these issues really have nothing to do with what it means to me to have a "relationship with God"/"belief in God" etc. To me what the Bible is about is a way to help you figure out how to deal with other people, how to live your life, not literally but more like a series of examples... I am open to the idea that there may be many ways to come about the same answers, found in other religions for example, and I think that the real goal is to try to live a loving, life, caring for others more than yourself, self-sacrificing if you will, not condemning others/judging anyone else, essentially following the examples set by Jesus in the stories found in the Bible.
I am a Christian so I will focus on that. Interestingly when you try to focus on what is really important about being a Christian (the characteristics mentioned above) alot of the crap people fight over is really unimportant, who cares how God created the world or whether he chose to tell us all about it 2000 years ago (again not buying this), in fact it doesn't really even matter if you look at Jesus as "God incarnate" or just a really good human example, what is important is not affected by these mediocrities.
If only some of these beliefs weren't so destructive, and actually produced responses and characteristics completely in contrast to the important things I would say believe what you want, unfortunately things like blind faith and taking the bible literally lead to horrible consequences, hatred of others, a sense of self-righteousness rather than humility, a tendency to be judgemental and closed minded. Horrible reprecussions of religion and indeed a very evil force in the world in my opinon.
To quote Rodney King "Why can't we just all get along" I mean come on, have some respect for other peoples beliefs and cultures, do your best to live a loving life and use your minds! Things are not automatically true because some king in the 16th century decided to put them together in a book.
Again, I like to think about these things and am definately still in a learning process and would love to hear comments and other opinions.
Thanks for "listening" hope you have a wonderful weekend!!!
Hi becaff,
I’m not sure if we can continue this discussion here but let’s just go where the scenery takes us. Thanks, a lot of your thoughts (on religion/faith/life) mirror mine read here and I have appealed quite a few times for tolerance and understanding (nicely when I'm in a good mood). Like what I said in the God and Evolution thread, this forum is an infidel stronghold (at least when you consider most of the active vocal ones) so I think it would be better to stay away from discussions about faith and religion bec mudslinging, accusations or flaming are an inevitability and those who are compelled to speak out (you only need to browse this evolution forum to get a handle on how things go) risk being labelled nutters.
If we keep silent then we feel guilty that we’re just affirming or accepting whatever is being said…so it’s damned if we do, damned if we don’t. We’re such fair game for ridicule, condescension or even pity (us poor deluded humans).
Having my faith is a personal choice and I don’t need any validation for this. In fact I resent it when I feel that I have to defend this choice. I’m not averse to having real discussions on religion and faith, even if I were not a believer, I’d still be interested in theology and religious epistemology and the origin of faith…I’m also very much still in the learning process but I guess for some people this is just a waste of time…
and then somehow, whenever these kinds of discussions crop up esp with unbelievers, I get this insane feeling that I have to sharpen my wooden stakes and polish my silver bullets…oh and wear an armour (a chain mail hauberk)
really over-the-top… and yet bec of all my moderate views on how I should live my faith, with all the filtering and screening that I do, I’m still classified as a cafeteria catholic. Have you ever felt such conflict? BTW I haven’t finished reading the book American Theocracy by Kevin Phillips…if you had read it what do you think…the guy is an alarmist or just overly-biased against the Bush Administration? If you haven’t read it, just your personal opinion, do you think that theocracy is really the prevailing form of government in the US? Did I just put you on the spot?
Have a nice weekend too.
Friday and still here...what a loser,
casandra
So, there is the question, who created who?
Are we created by a allknowing, allmighty god, or did we created gods by ourselves because we want them to be?
Do you have a reference for the brain stimulation story? Or is it another urban myth?
try looking up religiosity with connection to epilepsy